D411 Lock Mode?

[qwertymodo]

Does the D411 CIC found in most (NTSC) carts work in lock mode? From everything I've read, it would seem that it should, and the F411 used as the lock in the actual US consoles is the same chip as the one used as the key in special-chip (other than SA-1) carts, so I would assume that the D411 should work in both modes too, right? I just haven't found anywhere that anybody has actually done this to confirm. If it does, how would you go about connecting it?

[Markfrizb]

Just today, I accidentally fried the cic chip in the Snes jr. Console. I had a dead Doom cartridge so I removed the cic chip and replaced the fried one on the console with the one from the doom cart. Works great! Now, these are surface mount ic's but I don't think there is any functional difference between the DIP and surface mount cic's. aren't all the console's cic's surface mount anyways?

Are you asking how to put a DIP part in place of the surface mount cic?

[qwertymodo]

I'm asking if the DIP version found in most carts works as a replacement for the lock in the console. I'm not actually looking to transplant it into a console, it's for my microcontroller interface I've posted about a couple of times here. Yes, a SuperCIC is always an option, but I'm curious...

[Markfrizb]

I don't know if the dip can work as a replacement or not but after my repair yesterday, I'm leaning towards yes. What was your project?

[qwertymodo]

It's for this project. If nothing else, I can always use a SuperCIC lock, but if the D411 works in lock mode, I'd rather use that...

[Markfrizb]

What do want done and ill see if I can wire it in....

Mark

[qwertymodo]

Well, mostly I'm interested in how to connect the chip to the cart slot so it operates in lock mode. I'm not putting it in an actual console, so I don't care about the console connections like the console reset output or anything like that. Basically, I have a microcontroller-based cart reader (similar to the Retrode, but my PC interface isn't nearly as polished yet), and I'd like to add a CIC lock so I can talk to the special chip games that require the lock.

[Markfrizb]

I don't know how I can help with that.....
I can wire a cart cic I place of the console cic... Is this what you need to test?

[qwertymodo]

Sure, that would work. There's enough documentation on the CIC lock pinout for the SuperCIC mods that knowing whether or not it works in the console would probably give me enough to go on. Thanks a bunch

[Markfrizb]

Ok, Monday I'll wire one in and see what happens.





Mark


Edit: are any specific cic's you want me to test? Not sure what the variety that's available but I think there are different cic numbers on some

[qwertymodo]

Any one of the D411/A/B chips should be fine.

[Markfrizb]

Any one of the D411/A/B chips should be fine.

Ok, I'm wiring in a socket to test and have a question.
The console CIC is 18 pin part.
Cartridge CIC is a 16 pin part.

How should I wire them together?

[qwertymodo]

Any one of the D411/A/B chips should be fine.

Ok, I'm wiring in a socket to test and have a question.
The console CIC is 18 pin part.
Cartridge CIC is a 16 pin part.

How should I wire them together?

I don't know, that's kind of the point

But in any case, since I couldn't find a pinout of the F411, I did some tracing myself, both in key mode (on an MMX2 cart) and in lock mode (on a console motherboard I removed the CIC from) and I also used the connection notes in the SuperCIC lock source, and this is what I came up with:

Code: Select all

       D411 (Key)              F411 (Key)             F411 (Lock)
        __   __                 __   __                 __   __
       |  \_/  |               |  \_/  |               |  \_/  |
 D1(24)|1    16|Vcc      D1(24)|1    18|Vcc      D1(55)|1    18|Vcc
 D0(55)|2    15|NC       D0(55)|2    17|NC       D0(24)|2    17|NC
     NC|3    14|NC           NC|3    16|NC           ??|3    16|NC
    GND|4    13|NC          GND|4    15|NC          Vcc|4    15|NC
     NC|5    12|NC           NC|5    14|NC           NC|5    14|NC
CLK(56)|6    11|NC           NC|6    13|NC           NC|6    13|NC
RST(25)|7    10|NC      CLK(56)|7    12|NC      CLK(56)|7    12|NC
    GND|8     9|NC      RST(25)|8    11|NC          RST|8    11|S_RST(25)
       |_______|            GND|9    10|NC          GND|9    10|H_RST
                               |_______|               |_______|

*I'm not sure what pin 3 is in lock mode, but it connects to the aluminum can capacitor just next to the CIC on the console motherboard.

My best guess for connections is to act like pins 5 and 15 of the F411 (the middle pin on either side) don't exist and then just wire the D411 straight in.

So:

Code: Select all

D         F
1..4   -> 1..4
5..8   -> 6..9
9..12  -> 10..13
13..16 -> 15..18

[Markfrizb]

Ok. I'll give it a try.

Let you know in a few days

Mark

[qwertymodo]

No need. I got bored. It works, using the pinout I came up with above.