inceptional's composite discussion thread

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rainwarrior
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Re: Two Ship mode 5 hires + interlaced comparison

Post by rainwarrior »

I don't mind some digression, the effect of composite on mode 5 is an OK topic, but at this point the concept that SCART is composite has been explained at least 3 times to inceptional in this thread alone. This is not productive anymore.

I need to monitor this thread in case someone has actual questions or commentary on the originating post, so please, if you want to continue your discussion with inceptional, please start a new thread. Use a quote and/or link to this thread if you want to start it off with context.
iNCEPTIONAL

Re: Two Ship mode 5 hires + interlaced comparison

Post by iNCEPTIONAL »

Pokun wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 3:44 pm Rainwarrior I'm sorry to continue this discussion in this thread, but it's not settled yet.

iNCEPTIONAL wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 3:50 am Well, I don't really recall exactly what cable I had back in the day 100% beyond "I used SCART", but I do know you can get RGB SCART for SNES as I understand it (whether that's a relatively new thing or whatever):

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Generic-Scart- ... B01AWC7OUO
https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/pac ... -cable-pal
https://coolnovelties.co.uk/coolnovelti ... cable.html

Etc.

All I'm really saying here is that I certainly didn't use basic Composite as it's always shown in YouTube videos and images and the like, which looks like complete and utter turd, and I used what we call a SCART [or possibly S-Video if my memory is slightly off and it wasn't specifically SCART on my SNES and I'm confusing that with my other other consoles, which I honestly don't think I am] cable in the UK [however you want to break that down in terms of the exact definition of each variation of "SCART"] that looked basically as good as any connection I've ever seen for the SNES (even on an old CRT SDTV).
I'm saying that you definitely used composite. If you used the SCART connector or RCA connector matters not. SCART can carry composite as I've been saying and that's what your SCART cable did. SNES RGB and S-video cables exists now (I have both myself) but didn't exist back in the day. The only way you could have used RGB or S-video back then is if you or your foster parents built their own cable, and it doesn't sound like they did.

So no you did not use RGB nor S-video but good old PAL composite.
Edit: To be real clear here, I never once said my SNES was connected up via RGB SCART; I just said SCART. And I've only ever used RGB in here in response to other people brining it up. It was you [or someone else] who brought RGB SCART into this discussion initially for some reason, and now have somehow managed to twist things around as if it was me who claimed my SNES was connected via RGB or whatever (talk about gaslighting). I simply said my PAL SNES was connected via SCART, which it was (even if it was the original cables plugged into a SCART connector/adapter or whatever--which still gives a superior picture to the standard in-the-box connection), and it looked far better than NTSC Composite (and not NTSC Composite plugged into a SCART connector, just plain old Composite out the box).

I feel like this forum has a serious problem with gaslighting.

Then, to respond to you, like I said, my PAL [Composite] signal running through that SCART connector--and I really care not how that SCART connector ultimately does its thing--is simply better looking than the NTSC Composite I see time and time again as it appears in YouTube videos and images online. That is literally just a fact as I have observed it and am relaying that to you. You may have an image that suggests otherwise in some folder somewhere--go get it. . . . But I've not seen your image that shows the NTSC display signal looking better than or even as good as the PAL one. I've seen the images and videos I've seen, and they 100% reflect what I am telling you I have seen, that my UK PAL SNES connected via SCART looked better than every single image of US NTSC Composite footage/images I have ever seen.

And, given that the PAL display signal is apparently technically superior to the NTSC display signal right at its core because of how each display tech/solution was developed*, I'm even going to suggest the PAL Composite-to-SCART is probably slightly superior to NTSC Composite-to-SCART too anyway. I'm just speculating here, but so be it. Feel free to prove otherwise if you disagree, by showing me the example where the NTSC Composite-to-SCART image looks as good as or even better than the PAL Composite-to-SCART image. . . .

So far, you've shown me LITERALLY NOTHING to prove that my point about my SCART-connected SNES visuals looking vastly superior to any out-the-box NTSC Composite visuals I've seen online is incorrect. And that's really all I'm saying at the end of the day, which goes to why I simply will not EVER take seriously some view of how good or bad some SNES mode/effect is going to look based on viewing it through the lens of basic NTSC Composite (as apparently most people in here seem to be doing for whatever reason), which, again, represents the worst possible way of viewing SNES visuals I have ever seen. That's simply not the yard stick I have ever used, currently use, or will use in the future to judge how good something is going to look on SNES. Again, which is all I'm ultimately saying in response to whomever asserting that some mode/effect on SNES does/will look bad [as viewed on an NTSC SNES via basic Composite].

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JFt6t6ijLs
https://www.howtogeek.com/428987/whats- ... c-and-pal/
https://www.easytechjunkie.com/what-is- ... nd-pal.htm
http://www.differencebetween.info/diffe ... sc-and-pal
Last edited by iNCEPTIONAL on Thu May 19, 2022 6:06 pm, edited 16 times in total.
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rainwarrior
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Re: inceptional's composite discussion thread

Post by rainwarrior »

Okay fine, I'll start my own new thread. You can have this one to yourself.
Fiskbit
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Re: Two Ship mode 5 hires + interlaced comparison

Post by Fiskbit »

iNCEPTIONAL wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 4:18 pm I feel like this forum has a serious problem with gaslighting.

Then, to respond to you, like I said, my PAL [Composite] signal running through that SCART connector--and I really care not how that SCART connector ultimately does its thing--is simply better looking than the NTSC Composite I see time and time again as it appears in YouTube videos and images online. That is literally just a fact as I have observed it and am relaying that to you. You may have an image that suggests otherwise in some folder somewhere--go get it. . . . But I've not seen your image that shows the NTSC display signal looking better than or even as good as the PAL one. I've seen the images and videos I've seen, and they 100% reflect what I am telling you I have seen, that my UK PAL SNES connected via SCART looked better than every single image of US NTSC Composite footage/images I have ever seen.

And, given that the PAL display signal is apparently technically superior to the NTSC display signal right at its core because of how each display tech/solution was developed*, I'm even going to suggest the PAL Composite-to-SCART is probably slightly superior to NTSC Composite-to-SCART too anyway. I'm just speculating here, but so be it. Feel free to prove otherwise if you disagree, by showing me the example where the NTSC Composite-to-SCART image looks as good as or even better than the PAL Composite-to-SCART image. . . .

So far, you've shown me LITERALLY NOTHING to prove that my point about my SCART-connected SNES visuals looking vastly superior to any out-the-box NTSC Composite visuals I've seen online is incorrect. And that's really all I'm saying at the end of the day, which goes to why I simply will not EVER take seriously some view of how good or bad some SNES mode/effect is going to look based on viewing it through the lens of basic NTSC Composite (as apparently most people in here seem to be doing for whatever reason), which, again, represents the worst possible way of viewing SNES visuals I have ever seen. That's simply not the yard stick I have ever used, currently use, or will use in the future to judge how good something is going to look on SNES. Again, which is all I'm ultimately saying in response to whomever asserting that some mode/effect on SNES does/will look bad [as viewed on an NTSC SNES via basic Composite].

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JFt6t6ijLs
https://www.howtogeek.com/428987/whats- ... c-and-pal/
https://www.easytechjunkie.com/what-is- ... nd-pal.htm
http://www.differencebetween.info/diffe ... sc-and-pal
If you don't like our answers, and you think we're gaslighting you, then you're welcome to go somewhere else. You have 350 posts here in a matter of just a few months, so I assume you feel you're getting something of value from us. Act like you value this space or stop using our resources. I've said this before, but we have no obligation to you. We don't owe you anything. You are receiving free help, and a lot of it. If you don't like an answer, that's on you. You can accept it, you can do additional research yourself, you can ask specific followup questions, you can provide actual evidence to the contrary, whatever. That's all fine. What's not helpful is walls of text saying the same things over and over while accusing us of trying to make you think you're crazy. That is not the appropriate way of conversing here, nor is it productive. For being someone who keeps saying you don't have technical skills, you sure have very strong opinions on the topic and keep thinking you know better than people who know it well. Yes, maybe we're wrong, but we volunteers do not have to prove things to you.
iNCEPTIONAL

Re: Two Ship mode 5 hires + interlaced comparison

Post by iNCEPTIONAL »

Fiskbit wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 8:59 pm
iNCEPTIONAL wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 4:18 pm I feel like this forum has a serious problem with gaslighting.

Then, to respond to you, like I said, my PAL [Composite] signal running through that SCART connector--and I really care not how that SCART connector ultimately does its thing--is simply better looking than the NTSC Composite I see time and time again as it appears in YouTube videos and images online. That is literally just a fact as I have observed it and am relaying that to you. You may have an image that suggests otherwise in some folder somewhere--go get it. . . . But I've not seen your image that shows the NTSC display signal looking better than or even as good as the PAL one. I've seen the images and videos I've seen, and they 100% reflect what I am telling you I have seen, that my UK PAL SNES connected via SCART looked better than every single image of US NTSC Composite footage/images I have ever seen.

And, given that the PAL display signal is apparently technically superior to the NTSC display signal right at its core because of how each display tech/solution was developed*, I'm even going to suggest the PAL Composite-to-SCART is probably slightly superior to NTSC Composite-to-SCART too anyway. I'm just speculating here, but so be it. Feel free to prove otherwise if you disagree, by showing me the example where the NTSC Composite-to-SCART image looks as good as or even better than the PAL Composite-to-SCART image. . . .

So far, you've shown me LITERALLY NOTHING to prove that my point about my SCART-connected SNES visuals looking vastly superior to any out-the-box NTSC Composite visuals I've seen online is incorrect. And that's really all I'm saying at the end of the day, which goes to why I simply will not EVER take seriously some view of how good or bad some SNES mode/effect is going to look based on viewing it through the lens of basic NTSC Composite (as apparently most people in here seem to be doing for whatever reason), which, again, represents the worst possible way of viewing SNES visuals I have ever seen. That's simply not the yard stick I have ever used, currently use, or will use in the future to judge how good something is going to look on SNES. Again, which is all I'm ultimately saying in response to whomever asserting that some mode/effect on SNES does/will look bad [as viewed on an NTSC SNES via basic Composite].

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JFt6t6ijLs
https://www.howtogeek.com/428987/whats- ... c-and-pal/
https://www.easytechjunkie.com/what-is- ... nd-pal.htm
http://www.differencebetween.info/diffe ... sc-and-pal
If you don't like our answers, and you think we're gaslighting you, then you're welcome to go somewhere else. You have 350 posts here in a matter of just a few months, so I assume you feel you're getting something of value from us. Act like you value this space or stop using our resources. I've said this before, but we have no obligation to you. We don't owe you anything. You are receiving free help, and a lot of it. If you don't like an answer, that's on you. You can accept it, you can do additional research yourself, you can ask specific followup questions, you can provide actual evidence to the contrary, whatever. That's all fine. What's not helpful is walls of text saying the same things over and over while accusing us of trying to make you think you're crazy. That is not the appropriate way of conversing here, nor is it productive. For being someone who keeps saying you don't have technical skills, you sure have very strong opinions on the topic and keep thinking you know better than people who know it well. Yes, maybe we're wrong, but we volunteers do not have to prove things to you.
To include the important part you just cut out here:

"Edit: To be real clear here, I never once said my SNES was connected up via RGB SCART; I just said SCART. And I've only ever used RGB in here in response to other people brining it up. It was you [or someone else] who brought RGB SCART into this discussion initially for some reason, and now have somehow managed to twist things around as if it was me who claimed my SNES was connected via RGB or whatever (talk about gaslighting). I simply said my PAL SNES was connected via SCART, which it was (even if it was the original cables plugged into a SCART connector/adapter or whatever--which still gives a superior picture to the standard in-the-box connection), and it looked far better than NTSC Composite (and not NTSC Composite plugged into a SCART connector, just plain old Composite out the box)."

Given it's a demonstrable fact that people in this very thread created a false narrative about RGB in response to something I said that had nothing to do with RGB and then proceeded to comment as if I had said something about RGB and that I was basically making incorrect statements about how PAL SCART works when I absolutely was not--this is literally what gaslighting is--maybe they could just try a little harder not do that.

I come here for the useful answers, of which there are many, not for the ones where some people apparently make up what we're talking about in their own heads and then try to make it look like I'm the one causing the issue by not talking about things correctly.

And this has happened multiple times in this forum now, so I will absolutely call it out. Gaslighting is not something that should be tolerated in any public forum, especially by any moderators that take their job seriously and want a fair and safe place for people to discuss whatever topics.

Also, it's not your job to now subtly make me feel threatened for calling that out either, like I'm going to receive another temporary ban for a few days for simply bringing this problem up in the exact thread where I noticed it happening and went back and literally checked every single post just to double check it actually was happening--I really shouldn't have to do that, but the same false narrative would have continued if I hadn't--even though it was literally other people doing the gaslighting.

I have a right to ask for people to not [unintentionally or otherwise] abuse me, and the response shouldn't be to suggest I just leave the forum, which doesn't come across as particularly empathetic. I would think you would understand and agree with that.

Like I said, I get plenty of very helpful and useful responses too, and indeed fair ones, and those are the ones I come here for.
Last edited by iNCEPTIONAL on Fri May 20, 2022 2:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
lidnariq
Posts: 11432
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am

Re: Two Ship mode 5 hires + interlaced comparison

Post by lidnariq »

iNCEPTIONAL wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 2:03 am And this has happened multiple times in this forum now, so I will absolutely call it out. Gaslighting is not something that should be tolerated in any public forum, especially by any moderators that take their job seriously and want a fair and safe place for people to discuss whatever topics.
Let me be perfectly clear:

Fiskbit's statement is the official position of the moderators and the staff. You have alienated almost everyone, and every post from you is a chore. You take your perception of what you wish were true, and use it to cherry-pick subsets of what other people say to justify your conclusions.

You can shape up and start treating other people with respect, including accepting answers that you don't like.

Or you can choose to leave, and no-one will miss you.

Or we can force you to leave, and we will celebrate.


This is your formal, public, final warning. There will be no third chance. Replying to me with anything other than "I understand" will result in a permanent ban.
iNCEPTIONAL

Re: Two Ship mode 5 hires + interlaced comparison

Post by iNCEPTIONAL »

I understand.
iNCEPTIONAL

Re: inceptional's composite discussion thread

Post by iNCEPTIONAL »

OK, I'm dropping this topic because I dont want to get banned.

But, just to be clear, I have explained how gaslighting was occurring in this thread (and you can go check the entire conversation history in here to see I did not bring RGB into the discussion or misinterpretate was I was saying; it was the other person that did this and kept pushing that narrative), mentioned that I believe that's what's happened in the other examples that you are now once again attributing to me (I REALLY shouldn't have to go prove the other examples where the narrative got twisted were literally gaslighting too), and you are now threatening me with a permanent ban for pointing this out.

Can you please remove this entire thread, which has even been titled as if it is my thread by rainwarrior when it absolutley is not my thread, as I do not wish to have it open going forward?

I don't want to continue this topic but I will feel compelled to continue to defend myself if it remains open and other people post anything that suggests I created this whole issue about RGB when I absolutely did not, so I personally would prefer it to be removed.

Is that possible?
lidnariq
Posts: 11432
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am

Re: inceptional's composite discussion thread

Post by lidnariq »

I have locked this thread has been locked due to not being productive beyond the original post.
Locked