FDSLoadr Cable?

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 6:47 pm

So I bought an FDS RAM cart and a quality Famiclone online, with the intention to build the parallel-port->FDS cable and use it for homebrew purposes. My question is, has anyone here done this before, and if so, do you have any advice? Obviously, the wire and parallel-port connector are a cinch to get ahold of, but what about the FDS end of the cable? The text file says it's a good idea to use copper-clad PCB and simply separate it into evenly-spaced pins, but, newcomer that I am, I'm unsure if PCBs are made in differing thicknesses and, if so, what size would fit best into the FDS cartridge cable. Any advice woulod be much appreciated.

85cocoa · Post by **85cocoa** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:18 am

"Quality" Famiclone? What manufacturer/model is it? With regard to famiclones, how "standard" is the expansion port used by the FDS unit?

kyuusaku · Post by **kyuusaku** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 6:23 am

The only Famiclones I've seen with expansion ports are ones from the late 80s-early 90s (the ones which look like a Famicom and have discrete components)

The expansion port is also NOT used by the FDS. The expansion port is only good for audio and a few I/O bits generally used for extra controller data, not "highspeed" interfacing.

commodorejohn wrote:So I bought an FDS RAM cart and a quality Famiclone online, with the intention to build the parallel-port->FDS cable and use it for homebrew purposes. My question is, has anyone here done this before, and if so, do you have any advice? Obviously, the wire and parallel-port connector are a cinch to get ahold of, but what about the FDS end of the cable? The text file says it's a good idea to use copper-clad PCB and simply separate it into evenly-spaced pins, but, newcomer that I am, I'm unsure if PCBs are made in differing thicknesses and, if so, what size would fit best into the FDS cartridge cable. Any advice woulod be much appreciated.

If you're just interfacing the RAM adapter to the PC and don't plan to use it with the Disk Drive, you don't need a PCB at all. I would (and have) cut off the FDS connector and put on a DB25.

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 8:47 am

The one I'm planning to buy (I wrote "bought" by mistake, I haven't yet due to tight budget, college expenses, you know the drill,) is the Neo Fami on this page. It looks to be a pretty reputable company from what I can tell; has anyone here used one?

As for skipping the PCB, that's an even better idea, especially since I was lucky enough to score a pair of RAM adapters without having to buy a drive.

tokumaru · Post by **tokumaru** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:20 am

commodorejohn wrote:The one I'm planning to buy (I wrote "bought" by mistake, I haven't yet due to tight budget, college expenses, you know the drill,) is the Neo Fami on this page. It looks to be a pretty reputable company from what I can tell; has anyone here used one?

If I'm not mistaken, this is just another NOAC (NES-on-a-chip), as all newer famiclones. And AFAIK, their performance is questionable.

The best famiclones (IMO) are the older ones (such as the "Phantom System" or the "Turbo Game", both that used to be sold here in Brazil), that had all the individual chips, pretty similar to the real thing. I have a newer famiclone (brazillian Dynacom), a portable famiclone (Pokefami, manufactured by the same people that make the Neo Fami), an older famiclone (Turbo Game) and an actual NES.

The one that behaves most like the NES surelly is the Turbo Game. The Pokefami behaves very strangely when using it's built-in screen, but more normally when connected to the TV. The Neo Fami probably works just like this one, so I'm guessing it's not very good. The Turbo Game produces video and audio that is very similar to what the NES outputs. I haven't had the chance to test all systems with the so called "complex games" (that are known for not working on cheap famiclones) though.

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:36 am

Just *how* questionable is the performance? I'm not planning to do a lot of special raster effects or anything; I just need it to work with my FDS adapter.

rbudrick · Post by **rbudrick** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:50 am

The easiest way to make the FDS end of the cable (for reading disks and rewriting them, if your FDS is equipped to write), is to use a SNES audio/video cable. Make sure it has all 12 pins, though! I bought mine from Lik Sang. If the tip has all 12 pins (as thier stock did 2 years ago), you should be good. The plug is almost identical to the FDS plug, except the FDS plug is rounded on 2 corners and has right angles on the other two corners. whereas the SNES plug is rounded on all 4 corners. THe SNES plug also has a lttle strip of plastic you have to shave off.

Of course, the other method is to sacrifice a RAM adapter's cable for this.

Now, for the PC to RAM adapter cable for loading games directly from the PC to the RAM adapter, I used the audio video port from a broken SNES. Remember that since the RAM adapter's plug has those two sharp corners that you must carefully cut away two corners on the inside of this port to make the Ram Adapter's cable fit in. You could shave a bit off the two corners of the RAM adapter itself, but it makes more sense to do it to the female sideso you don't go putting the cable in upside down, not that you couldn't label it or something.

You can also sacrifice a FDS Drive's port for this, but it's kinda wasteful. The good news is that you can always hardwire the sacrificed ram adapter and FDS together after you snag the necessary components, only you won't be able to use that sacrificed system with FDSLoadr, just the FC.

-Rob

85cocoa · Post by **85cocoa** » Sat Oct 07, 2006 12:26 am

kyuusaku wrote:The expansion port is also NOT used by the FDS.

*facepalm*...um, I mean, thanks for correcting this long-standing misunderstanding of mine. The problem is that my brain was falsely arguing by analogy from the 64DD.

BTW:

tokumaru wrote:I haven't had the chance to test all systems with the so called "complex games" (that are known for not working on cheap famiclones) though.

What are the so-called "complex games" other than MMC5 and unlicensed ones?

Post by **tepples** » Sat Oct 07, 2006 2:10 pm

85cocoa wrote:
tokumaru wrote:I haven't had the chance to test all systems with the so called "complex games" (that are known for not working on cheap famiclones) though.
What are the so-called "complex games" other than MMC5 and unlicensed ones?

You're right that the best test cases for undocumented $2004 and $4010 behavior are Codemasters' unlicensed titles, but Battletoads (NTSC U/C) is licensed, right? It's the poster boy for PPU cycle timing.

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Mon Oct 09, 2006 3:13 pm

Well, I looked up some reviews of the Neo Fami and the general opinion was that it's a good deal. (The price is definitely right.) One user mentioned that their unit broke after a few uses, but the company I'm buying from will allow returns on defective units, so I think I'll go with it.

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:47 am

Well, the Neo Fami arrived today, and it works fine, with one quirk: the quarter-phase pulse output, for some reason, gets output as a half-phase pulse wave. I've only tested it with Final Fantasy so far; my guess (I'm not sure about this) is that perhaps pulse setting 3 (three-quarters phase, which sounds the same as quarter-phase) was overlooked and treated as half-phase, but I've yet to confirm this. The Famicom Disk System adapter boots fine, but I've yet to build the cable for further tests.

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Thu Nov 02, 2006 7:23 pm

Well, I made my first attempt at hooking up the RAM cart to the paralell port today, but no luck. The program and cartridge seem to be communicating with each other (the "disk in" signal is accurate and the program recognizes read attempts,) but nothing will load; it always reports an error 22 on the first file. Is this 22 decimal or 22 hex? 22 hex seems to mean, from the FDS technical reference I have, that it's expecting a file type of 1. 22 decimal doesn't seem to be a valid error code. Does anyone have any idea what's going on here?

rbudrick · Post by **rbudrick** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:34 am

If the .fds file loads in an emulator, then then the file's good. If not, then the file is probably corrupted, so use a different one.

Anyway, quadruple check your wiring, then do it again. Also, make sure you are running in pure DOS...no Windows, and definitely not Win XP. Having a machine loaded with Win 98 works for me (well, I do have to boot to pure DOS, but you know what I mean), but just a pure DOS box will do the trick too.

Also, you may have to set your parallel port in your BIOS to EPP mode. Also, it probably won't work on most laptops. Even so, try it on several computers, if possible. Some parallel port's controller chips are ghetto shit, but this is mostly a problem only on laptops, and possibly, though unconfirmed, some small form factor desktops.

It sounds like a wiring problem, but try the above and let us know.

-Rob

commodorejohn · Post by **commodorejohn** » Sat Nov 25, 2006 9:42 am

Update: I tried it on another computer, and it worked at least partially; it loads fine from side A, but it either takes a long time loading from side B or it doesn't work on side B. I checked the BIOS settings on the original computer and the parallel port was *not* set to EPP mode, so I'm going to give it a shot in the proper mode.

At any rate, progress has been made. Thank you all very much for your advice.

Jagasian · Post by **Jagasian** » Sun Nov 26, 2006 6:37 pm

commodorejohn wrote:Just *how* questionable is the performance? I'm not planning to do a lot of special raster effects or anything; I just need it to work with my FDS adapter.

Some games don't run at all. Some games run but with bugs. Most games run, but with incorrect sound and colors. Apparently the world map in The Legend of Zelda bugs out after playing for a bit. In other words, its performance is worse than modern emulators.

I'd recommend a real Famicom. There are, what, hundreds of thousands floating around out there. They can't be hard to find, and buying the real deal helps preserve the original as opposed to perpetuating fakes.