Is blargg around?

[qbradq]

"Don't be a Dick" is the best advice a father can give his son, and it's certainly the golden rule of the interwebs.

Like that other thread where the guy said he was uncomfortable giving his real name to folks on the forum, and then a few dicks wanted to show off how super-cool they were and find his real name. That's just being a dick, and is not constructive.

It's sad that we don't have Blargg around anymore. I was just beginning to realize the importance of his contributions when I realized he was no longer involved.

Anyway, the moral of this thread (not Blargg's departure, I'm sure he had better reasons that internet dickbaggery) is to ignore what irritates you. Only put on the fighting gloves when it is something actually important, like a web site selling unlicensed repro's that obviously violate the rights of the creators. Not that I've seen anyone actually take a stand against RetroZone for that

[tepples]

Anyway, the moral of this thread (not Blargg's departure, I'm sure he had better reasons that internet dickbaggery) is to ignore what irritates you.

Unless what irritates one has the force of law, such as DMCA/EUCD-backed cryptographic lockouts, copyright term extensions, or the threat of lawsuits over accidental plagiarism.

Only put on the fighting gloves when it is something actually important, like a web site selling unlicensed repro's that obviously violate the rights of the creators. Not that I've seen anyone actually take a stand against RetroZone for that

To an extent I take comfort in at least one of RetroZone's repros. As long as bunnyboy continues to get away with selling copies of Tetris as part of his NWC repro, I have nothing to fear from The Tetris Company by making LJ65 available under a free software license.

[qbradq]

To an extent I take comfort in at least one of RetroZone's repros. As long as bunnyboy continues to get away with selling copies of Tetris as part of his NWC repro, I have nothing to fear from The Tetris Company by making LJ65 available under a free software license.

Good point

Unless what irritates one has the force of law, such as DMCA/EUCD-backed cryptographic lockouts, copyright term extensions, or the threat of lawsuits over accidental plagiarism.

Hence this statement:

Only put on the fighting gloves when it is something actually important, like a web site selling unlicensed repro's that obviously violate the rights of the creators.

Incidentally that is another major reason I am trying to support the clone systems with my products. There is no need for the CIClone or other method of bypassing the DMA lockout on the toaster model.

[kevtris]

(note, this is not aimed at anyone, just a general rant)

I always remember what someone told me a long time ago, and as I get older I see it is more true than ever.

Simply, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything".

Sure there may be things I don't really agree with, but generally I will not bring it up since it's not worth the negative vibes, unless it's really egregious somehow.

So probably the best thing to do is just ignore threads you don't like, and not bring up the same constant complaints about people trying to make money off NES development. The simple fact of the matter is almost no one is going to actually make any decent money off it, no matter what they are selling. And as I get older I also understand how expensive (time wise if nothing else) a pursuit such as writing a game or developing a piece of hardware can be. If you've never put months or years of your life into something, you probably won't understand the desire to actually get something back from it, even if it's a token amount.

Figure you sell an NES game for $30 and make $10 on it, and sell 500 carts. That's a cool $5K in profit you can make... but how long did it take to get that game ready? 4-5 months? If so, that's selling time really cheap. Obviously you do it for the fun of it instead of the money and that's what it comes down to. The profit also doesn't account for the time spent making those cartridges either, or the money you had to front to buy those parts and boards and stuff.

All the money I have made off NES development of any stripe (yes even the Ciclones and Copynes') was plowed right back into my projects and development. That money was used to buy an oscilloscope that was then used to figure out the NES' video voltage ranges and some timing information. Scopes are expensive. Without the funds generated from my earlier work, I would not be able to perform the later stuff since I wouldn't have been able to afford the scope.

[Bregalad]

All the money I have made off NES development of any stripe (yes even the Ciclones and Copynes') was plowed right back into my projects

Man you're such a great guy !! I wish I could say that of everyone else but oh yeah...

Scopes are expensive.

If you buy a brand new one, yes. I got an used one for $50 in an old lab that didn't need them anymore though.

[qbradq]

kevtris, I totally feel where you are comming from. I released an XBOX LIVE Indy Game a few months back and almost cleared $3.00 an hour it I am using that money to fund my NES development efforts.

[tepples]

Consider it an internship that you can cite should you decide to seek employment in the mainstream video game industry or start your own studio. Or are NES games, XNA games, and Android games useless on a resume?

[kevtris]

All the money I have made off NES development of any stripe (yes even the Ciclones and Copynes') was plowed right back into my projects

Man you're such a great guy !! I wish I could say that of everyone else but oh yeah...

Scopes are expensive.

If you buy a brand new one, yes. I got an used one for $50 in an old lab that didn't need them anymore though.

A $50 scope is not going to be very good. The scope I bought cost $1500 and was used. New, it was around $8000 or so. I have a cheaper analog scope, but wanted a highly decent digital one with logic analyzer attachment.

[Kasumi]

Like that other thread where the guy said he was uncomfortable giving his real name to folks on the forum, and then a few dicks wanted to show off how super-cool they were and find his real name. That's just being a dick, and is not constructive.

Eh. I'm not happy about what I posted in that thread, but I'm not unhappy about it either. I found his real name, but didn't post it. I was just trying to give some (admittedly heavy handed) advice. I saw what he posted as unprofessional, and he absolutely would not get what he wanted with what he had posted. I was not trying to be "super-cool", though, I assure you.

I have funny ideas about free freelance work.

I don't accept free direct help just because it's free. Applying for a creative "job" without a resume or portfolio is a waste of time for everyone involved. Friends of mine offer me help like that all the time. "Oooh, you're making an NES game? I'll make music for it for free." And I always say, "No, because I can't afford to pay you and I don't like the idea of people 'working' for free for me." But the real answer is usually also, "No, because I don't like the music you make." I'm extremely hard to please, so if I didn't like a song I'd make them fix it and I think all the fun and novelty of making music for an NES game would quickly disappear for them. Not to mention I anticipate they would have to work under rather harsh limitations imposed by my music engine. Just because I'm doing this for as a side thing, does not mean I don't want it to look and feel like like a totally professional product.

That's why I'd rather pay them. I'm paying for them to deal with my feedback and guidelines. I don't want to pay for a bad product. And I don't want a cop out like, "Well, I'm doing this for free, so take it or leave it." Because then we have BOTH wasted our time. I don't think that's a bad attitude, honestly. It's like people who buy things or get things just because they're on sale or free. And then it sits in their house and they never use it.

On the internet, it's easier. If samples are posted that I don't like, I ignore the post. But if they're not... I'm stuck in the odd position of seeming interested, by asking for them, and then not replying when they're posted and I don't like them.

Which is part of why I don't agree with "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything."

If I posted something like doommaster did, I would MUCH MUCH MUCH rather have people say, "This style of music doesn't interest me." or "This music isn't practical for an NES game at all." than say nothing at all. If I didn't post samples, and someone told me that was why no one was replying, that's USEFUL. Much more useful than just no replies.

I realize what I tell my friends is dishonest. I'd honestly rather just tell them the truth, instead of being nice. "I don't like your music," will make them stop asking. What I say just makes them think they'll need to convince me that they're really okay with working for free. I hate that people (myself definitely included) are that uncomfortable with telling the truth because they're afraid of hurting someone's feelings. Especially in what could be considered a professional setting. "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything." is perhaps the reason so little valuable critique is given these days.

Unsolicited is different, though. If someone's just posting info about their game, and someone comes in on a tirade about how that person will eventually make money from it, that's being a dick. If someone asks for feedback, and the feedback is "I won't buy this at all," that's fine. If someone asks me, "Do you like the food I made?" I will usually give an honest answer. But I'm not going to tell someone I don't like it, if they don't specifically ask me.

I see threads like this on other forums.

Poster 1: "Here's a T-shirt design. Will you buy it?"
Poster 2: "Looks great."
Poster 1: "I don't care if you think it looks great. Does it look great enough for you to buy it?"
Poster 2: "Well... no."

So. "Don't be a dick." is fine. You can say something someone might consider, "not nice." without being a dick. Did I succeed at not being a dick in the topic you mentioned? Probably not. I tried not to be one though.

As for Blargg. It is like when Q(uietust) left. I am sure we will move passed it. The things he contributed were very valuable, but if he does not come back someone else will likely fill his shoes.

[koitsu]

As for Blargg. It is like when Q(uietust) left. I am sure we will move passed it. The things he contributed were very valuable, but if he does not come back someone else will likely fill his shoes.

For lack of better term, "NES audio people" are few and far between. There's been a very limited number of them, and all of them seem to disappear. The folks I got audio information from for NESTECH are gone, then Brad Taylor appeared (and is now also gone), then there's blargg (who too is gone). They're in limited supply, so the impact is greater. And that sucks.

[RushJet1]

I have funny ideas about free freelance work.

I don't accept free direct help just because it's free. Applying for a creative "job" without a resume or portfolio is a waste of time for everyone involved. Friends of mine offer me help like that all the time. "Oooh, you're making an NES game? I'll make music for it for free." And I always say, "No, because I can't afford to pay you and I don't like the idea of people 'working' for free for me." But the real answer is usually also, "No, because I don't like the music you make." I'm extremely hard to please, so if I didn't like a song I'd make them fix it and I think all the fun and novelty of making music for an NES game would quickly disappear for them. Not to mention I anticipate they would have to work under rather harsh limitations imposed by my music engine. Just because I'm doing this for as a side thing, does not mean I don't want it to look and feel like like a totally professional product.

That's why I'd rather pay them. I'm paying for them to deal with my feedback and guidelines. I don't want to pay for a bad product. And I don't want a cop out like, "Well, I'm doing this for free, so take it or leave it." Because then we have BOTH wasted our time. I don't think that's a bad attitude, honestly. It's like people who buy things or get things just because they're on sale or free. And then it sits in their house and they never use it.

You could just say that you're very picky about music in general, and that you don't feel that their style music would fit your game. If the friend is a good one, you can outright say "I don't particularly like your music" or something softer but with the same meaning, and if they are a real friend, they will probably just shrug it off (I have been told this by people, and I'm like "ok" most of the time instead of NERDRAGE "U DONT KNO WAT UR TLAKIN' BAOUT").

On the internet, it's easier. If samples are posted that I don't like, I ignore the post. But if they're not... I'm stuck in the odd position of seeming interested, by asking for them, and then not replying when they're posted and I don't like them.

Which is part of why I don't agree with "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything."

If I posted something like doommaster did, I would MUCH MUCH MUCH rather have people say, "This style of music doesn't interest me." or "This music isn't practical for an NES game at all." than say nothing at all. If I didn't post samples, and someone told me that was why no one was replying, that's USEFUL. Much more useful than just no replies.

I tend to do the ignore a post thing, but usually because I don't really want to be giving constructive criticism. If I did post, in the vast majority of cases of this happening, my posts would read "meh" or "i don't like it" which aren't helpful. On sites where lots of music is posted, it can get tiring to sift through 90% music you don't like and 10% that's at least OK, so that's where unresponsive audiences come from (8bc is an example).

I realize what I tell my friends is dishonest. I'd honestly rather just tell them the truth, instead of being nice. "I don't like your music," will make them stop asking. What I say just makes them think they'll need to convince me that they're really okay with working for free. I hate that people (myself definitely included) are that uncomfortable with telling the truth because they're afraid of hurting someone's feelings. Especially in what could be considered a professional setting. "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything." is perhaps the reason so little valuable critique is given these days.

Again, just tell them that you don't like their genre of music. I hear lots of music that I don't like but I can tell it's well-done for what it is.

As for Blargg. It is like when Q(uietust) left. I am sure we will move passed it. The things he contributed were very valuable, but if he does not come back someone else will likely fill his shoes.

This whole thing saddens me a bit. Even I had noticed his absence kind of, but thought "I must be missing his posts due to the fact that I only check like 3 subforums here." I doubt that he'll stop NES development entirely but maybe might take a break from it or something (I can't actually tell you because I know little about it, so [/speculation]).

Also why am I posting??? back to lurker mode

[qbradq]

Like that other thread where the guy said he was uncomfortable giving his real name to folks on the forum, and then a few dicks wanted to show off how super-cool they were and find his real name. That's just being a dick, and is not constructive.

Reading this again it appears that I could use my own advice My apologies for the inflammatory remarks Kasumi. I could have easily made my point without them.

[Kasumi]

I'm like "ok" most of the time instead of NERDRAGE "U DONT KNO WAT UR TLAKIN' BAOUT").

You would be the ideal response. I fear the unideal. I know people who have some egos about their work, but are perfectly fine people otherwise. I do not want to be the one to face the beast. Think deviantart drama ego, if you're familiar with that site. Unfortunately I live in fear of people exploding like that. Maybe I'm projecting, and it's me that's the problem, not the world.

On sites where lots of music is posted, it can get tiring to sift through 90% music you don't like and 10% that's at least OK, so that's where unresponsive audiences come from (8bc is an example).

I understand in that case, since it's a much larger "market". I'm not saying one should post in every thread giving constructive criticism, just that sometimes silence is not the best option. It's my view that if someone is doing something wrong, and no one says anything about it, they will continue to do it. It's a sliding scale I suppose. Is what they're doing annoying enough to justify saying something? For my friends offering help it doesn't come up often enough to justify it. But for the bootleg threads here? That was coming up fairly often, and I certainly understand the backlash some of them got.

I only posted in the other thread when my "scale" tipped because several people had interest, but he was not making it easy to accomplish his own goal.

I know some people who say politically incorrect things in some... bad situations. It's usually not annoying enough to say anything, but when it's really bad, you tell the person. Because if no one else does it, they will never think that it might be wrong. Say something in a non condescending tone. But say something.

This whole thing saddens me a bit.

I just get into the habit of making people on forums I frequent like celebrities. "Aw, man. All this stuff they create is amazing!" and when they disappear I had as much contact with them as I've always had, and people can still appreciate their stuff. When Michael Jackson died, Thriller didn't become a worse song. Shame there won't be new stuff, but I never talked to Michael anyway. Very nearly the same with Blargg leaving/hiatusing. I talked to him like once, he seems reasonable. All I really know about him are his contributions, though. I understand those who were in more regular contact with, yet not close enough to get the reasons for his departure, though.

Quietust still updates Nintendulator, and bunnyboy still updates powerpak mappers. Maybe blargg will continue to work on things, and post them someplace for us to find.

Also why am I posting??? back to lurker mode

Quite, quite. For me as well. I write too much anyway.

My apologies for the inflammatory remarks Kasumi.

Thank you. I apologize as well. By saying something, you made me feel I did something wrong and reflect on it. That is something I support.